On the one hand, even if it were true that the soul must be non-physical in order to grasp the non-physical forms, wouldn't follow that the soul will survive the death of the body.

一方面,即使,灵魂必须是非现实的,以便来认知非现实的型相,也没法推导出,灵魂可以在肉体死亡之后存活

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If we give him number two, it's going to follow that whatever's doing the grasping-- call that the soul since the soul is just Plato's word for our mind-- if whatever's doing the grasping of the eternal and non-physical forms must itself be eternal and non-physical, it follows that the soul must be non-physical.

假如我们承认前提二,那么接下来就是不管是什么事物在认知,姑且称之为灵魂好了,因为灵魂是柏拉图对我们心灵的称呼,假如能够认知永恒,和非现实型相的事物本身必须是,永恒和非现实的,那么灵魂必须是非现实的

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We can certainly think about the forms, but if they're non-physical they can't be grasped by something physical like the body.

我们当然能想象型相,但假如他们是非现实的,他们将不能被现实的事物,比如肉体,所认知

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The ideas or the forms justice itself, beauty itself, goodness itself the forms are not physical objects. Right?

理念或者型相,如正义,美丽,美德之类,它们并不是物理实体

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Since that which grasps the ideas or forms must be eternal or non-physical-- it's eternal, it's immortal.

同时能认知理念,或者型相的事物必须是永恒的或非现实的,所以灵魂是永恒的,不朽的

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It would seem to give us three, the conclusion we want-- that which grasps the ideas or the forms must be eternal or non-physical.

我们似乎就得到了第三条,也就是我们要的结论,能认知理念,或者型相的事物必须是永恒或非现实的

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So Platonic metaphysics gives us premise number one-- that ideas, forms, are eternal and they're non-physical.

柏拉图的形而上学论给了我们前提一,理念或者型相是永恒的,非现实的

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If the forms are not physical objects, then Socrates thinks it follows they can't be grasped.

如果型相不是物理实体,那么苏格拉底认为他们不可被认知

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So the Platonic metaphysics says quite generally, if we're thinking about the ideas or the forms, the point to grasp is they're eternal; they're non-physical.

柏拉图的形而上学论说得非常笼统,假如我们提到理念或者型相,要点就是他们是永恒的,是非现实的

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If that which grasps the ideas or the forms must be eternal/non-physical, well one thing we're going to get is, since that which grasps the forms must be non-physical, the soul is not the body.

假如能认知,理念或者型相的事物必须是永恒,非现实的,那么我们能得到的结论是,既然能认知型相的事物必须是非现实的,而且灵魂并不是肉体

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Ideas or forms are eternal; they're non-physical.

理念或者型相是永恒的,是非现实的

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